Pre-Discussion Thread

[Xon]

This thread is for pre-discussions. The Act creating this commission has not yet passed and so this thread has no official weight, but still we need to start discussing things immediately since Lavalon now has products for sale to its citizens.

First things first, Lavalon has a CafePress store with t-shirts designed by Regent Kristofe. I want to buy one of these really soon. Supposing I do, the profits (Jon said like 3 dollars for now) will go to the Lavalonian government. The CafePress profits actually will go to me in the form of, I think, a check in the mail. That is because I created the CafePress store and registered it under my mailing address.

I will be collecting profits from the store with the permission of Treasurer Henzelli (you don't mind, do you Henzelli?).

As you know it is not the responsibility of the Treasury or the Treasurer to determine how the government's money should be spent. That is the job of the General Assembly. The General Assembly, being too much wrapped up in mundane things like protecting the wild boar, will delegate to this Economic Development Exploratory Commission the power to decide government spending or income-taking habits. Of course all government budgetary decisions must eventually come to a vote, I'm pretty sure, in the General Assembly. So the General Assembly, also I'm pretty sure, could reject any decision of this Commission that it finds unnecessary or troublesome. This is my perspective on how things will operate in the near future.

I propose to this Commission, previous to its being made official, that we take the yearly profits from the sales and invest half into Silver Bars (for economic non-dependance on foreign currency, by Our Sovereign Republic), and the other half into "micro-salaries" and "prize winnings".

Who would get these micro-salaries? Only the President, Chief Justice, and Regent. Those are highly important "core" positions that need to be made worthy of those who fill them. Hence, micro-payments.

Who would get prize winnings? Winners of contests, like our Kay Francis annual essay contest. This would be a major attracting factor for prospective citizens.

What do you think?

[timjr]

Thank you for joining the pre-discussion, Carson.

--xon

[neem]

Discussing during the pre-discussion, ah that's awesome.

Silver bars... Bit complicated don't you think?

[csmith]

As I have said lord-knows-how-many times, this commission is NOT a standing committee. Its goal is to explore possibilities for developing an internal Lavalonian economy in which Lavalonian currency is being used, something along the lines of phpBank. People would be paid in this...I think every government official should have a salary in Lavalonian currency. Prizes for contests should be in Lavalonian currency. Add in services like web design, law, and such, most of which we already have, and you have currency with value because of the services...ECONOMY.

I don't like this whole thing about silver bars. Of course, if we don't invest in silver bars, that then brings up the question of what to do with the CafePress money. I would like to propose we buy a domain name for Lavalon. Some money every month will have to go to the maintenance costs for this, and I suspect we may have to reach into our own pockets once in a while, and I think the rest should go to offline recruitment efforts. Perhaps, if we still have some left (Realistically, I doubt we will at this point.), we can put it towards a SMALL American dollar salary for high-ranking government officials...Chief Justice, Regent, President, etc.

[timjr]

I agree that a domain name is needed. That should probably be the first thing on our spending list.

[Bartholomew Henzelli]

I agree with the domain name. That should be our first priority in regards to how to SPEND the money.

The next question is our priorities in GETTING the money. T-shirt sales are fluid at best, and non-existent at worst. We can never be sure how much money we will be bringing in, so we have to apropriate our money accordingly.

Salaries for government officials are the LAST thing we should worry about, considering that salaries require a constant source of income.

[csmith]

Yes. We need to be realistic here...we aren't going to make millions from a CafePress store. Before anyone suggests it, I will not support charging a fee for Lavalonian citizenship.

[timjr]

That you just mentioned paid citizenships put a real bad taste in my mouth, and I'll probably have to wash it out with some Coca-Cola(R) Classic.

What's wrong with speculating what we do with the money? Also, did anyone notice where I wrote "yearly profits"?

At the end of the year 2005, we might have, say, 10 dollars in profits. Five dollars would go towards a couple of ounce silver bars. The other five would go towards an expenditure fund, for whatever the general assembly decides.

About the silver bars: as long as we're using America's currency, our economy is based on America. There's nothing wrong with keeping half of our income in American dollars. I do think, however, that we need to have a substantial amount of financial independence from any sovereign nation. I think we need silver. It's symbolic.

Well, if nobody likes the salary idea, I have a better idea: we split half of the remainder among the Cultural and Executive branches. Neem can spend the money on whatever she wants, and Regent Jon can do whatever he likes with the money. It's only fair, since they earned their positions by popular election, and since they need money to do stuff.

[Bartholomew Henzelli]

So far, I have yet to see ANYTHING from the presidency or regency requiring money coming from us.
The expenses required to maintain the cafe-press store are figured into the prices, so we're not spending any money on it and the markup is pure profit.

I agree that we need something that would keep us independent of a foreign economy. Silver is a good idea and I would support it. If the American economy suddenly crashes, we'd probably all lose internet access, but at least we'd be able to sell our silver on other markets for stronger currency and, in turn, help strengthen our economy.

**Edited: grammatical and spelling errors.

[timjr]

If the American economy suddenly crashes, we'd probably all lose internet access, but at least we'd be able to sell our silver on other markets for stronger currency and, in turn, help strengthen our economy.

We could always cash in our silver for US or European currency. We might make a profit,too, if the price of silver goes up. Until somebody actually builds an asteroid mine, silver is a good investment.

[csmith]

I'm sorry, I refuse to have the majority of the Lavalonian economy operating in U.S. dollars. Lavalon is Lavalon, not America.

[timjr]

Agreed.

[csmith]

Okay, so are you agreeing with me that we shouldn't pay people in U.S.D. and all that?

[Jonathan Christophé]

Um, one thing here, as an investment, precious metals and other commodities are the most risky you can get. There is room for a great deal of profit, but also a great deal of loss.

I'm not distinctively against it, I just want everybody to understand that con.

[neem]

Who's against people getting salaries? ME! The person who actually might get one. There's no need, let's give up this idea.

Silver... how about no. Ok, come on, how much silver do you think you could get with like $10 bucks?

We could just save up and then get Lavalon merchandise for all of its citizens.

Lavo is a nice idea, but it has no real world value. It's kinda complicated. We have to be a bit realistic here.

I'm agreeing with Xon on what he said about the US dollar.